Katie Cash [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the AEC Marketing for Principals podcast. This show is designed as a conversation between sales and marketing principals to address trends, challenges, and best practices that are driving growth for professional service firms. Through our collection of discussions with subject matter experts, industry legends, and leaders, we aim to share thoughts and practical tips with our listeners that that you can use for growing your AEC brands. Hosted by me, Katie Cash, Senior Vice President at Smartegies, the AEC growth consulting firm that’s been developing smart business strategies for design and construction firms since 2008.
Katie Cash [00:00:43]:
Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of AEC Marketing for Principals. Thanks for tuning in today. We are continuing with the series of 2026 all about changemakers. And when you think about changemakers in AEC, I bet you have someone pictured in your mind. It’s probably someone that you associate with pushing innovation within your firm or within your industry. Maybe they’ve modernized how work is getting done, or maybe they’ve simply just raised the expectation for what good looks like in today’s customer service-driven world. And I’m excited to be talking today with my guest, Suzie Engel, who is doing exactly all of that. And more.
Katie Cash [00:01:26]:
She’s doing 5 million things plus one, and she leads Motz Engineering and a few other companies because she’s a serial entrepreneur and just can’t help herself. But what I love about Suzie and what I really want to share with you all today in the episode is how she thoughtfully builds culture, how she utilizes systems and data to make a culture for accountability, and how she really does bring forward those points of accountability not being a back-office detail. She really believes to her heart that this is how you protect quality within the design and construction space. And with quality, you’re able to earn trust, and with trust, you’re able to grow and scale a business and maybe do so without chaos, or maybe manageable chaos. Suzie, that might be something. So I’m excited to talk today with Suzie and how she is reshaping what leadership looks like within a multidisciplinary firm, because Motz is a mechanical, electrical, plumbing, and commissioning firm, and really talking about how she’s using process and proof to create a better customer experience for the clients and the project partners that she serves. So Suzie, thank you for carving time out of your very, very busy day and coming on the show with me.
Suzie Engel [00:02:39]:
Wow. Thanks, Katie. Thanks very much. That was a really nice introduction. I hope that I live up to all of that, but yeah, just taking one step at a time and being present, focusing on culture, like you said, that’s a big deal. So thank you.
Katie Cash [00:02:53]:
Well, I know you, I’ve had the opportunity to work alongside you for a little bit of time, and I feel like I practiced restraint not trying to brag too hard on you, so. That you could come across as like an attainable leadership goal. So let’s start there because it’s not like you just stepped into leadership when you took the job. I think you kind of took your time, you looked it over, and sure, you kept the trains running, but your idea was to kind of reshape, redesign the whole operating system, really pinpointing quality at the forefront and making sure that you were building a repeatable customer experience so that you, Suzie, didn’t have to be the primary point contact on every job, right? Everybody that was working with you and partnering with you at your firm could exercise the same level of quality that customers were coming to associate with the Motz Engineering brand.
Suzie Engel [00:03:45]:
Yep. That’s totally right. That’s exactly it. When I joined Motz, I had spent 3 years in a service, oil service company, Summerjay, down in Houston and Louisiana., and now I’ve been doing this for 10 years, which is kind of wild. But that service-minded, professional services, so you’d think, you know, service is in the name. It’s not consistent everywhere. Luckily at Motz it was, so that wasn’t something that like a giant culture shift or anything like that. But that focus on service, talking with the client, listening to the client, making sure that they feel heard, getting that into the product, the delivery, understanding the expectation.
Suzie Engel [00:04:26]:
Not just delivering it on time the first time, but every single time. That clear communication, communication skills in general, I feel like that’s not consistent everywhere. And a lot of times we can actually help our clients, whether they’re another engineering firm or an architecture firm, actually be even better. Because if we’re clearly communicating with them, they can clearly communicate with the building owner or the developer. Or the industrial company, whatever it is. And that goes back to the process, just being able to clearly understand where we are. We on first base, second base, where are we? What’s the next step to get to the finish line? So, I mean, that was totally, that’s totally the culture though in other industries. It’s a culture in car manufacturing, certainly in oil and gas, certainly in power plant, power generation.
Suzie Engel [00:05:17]:
So why not in the professional services? Why can’t it be here too?
Katie Cash [00:05:21]:
I think that’s really fun to think about. Services is in our industry name, but we all kind of have a different idea of what service looks like, good service looks like. We all know what bad service feels like, but then being really intentional on, I think you, you hit the nail on the head, listening. I can’t even count on my hands how many owners have sat where you sit today, been on this podcast with me, and kind of talked about how our industry, design, construction, engineering, program managers, you know, whole host of consultants, they are experts. They are experts in their field and they’re really good at that. But the soft skills of listening and like listening with intent and then maybe translating their expertise in a manner in which they understand when they’re listening on the other side, language is a total, totally learned practice, right? We have very, very technical, you know, building systems that you’re working on. Projects are complex. These are big-ticket items from a budget standpoint, if you get the communication wrong, it could really cause major, like, negative ripples downstream, whether it’s budget impact, schedule impact, you know, constructability challenges.
Katie Cash [00:06:31]:
So maybe let’s talk a little bit, Suzie, about your quest for systems and your quest for data so that you could make data-informed decisions on what was really working in this Sirius-driven organization and maybe dialing up what works really well and plugging the gap where there were other challenges?
Suzie Engel [00:06:51]:
I mean, at most, I would say probably at most firms, I mean, your biggest source of data in, data out is just simply your email, right? But tracking deliverables, tracking requests, what needs to go out when and how, that was more or less a juggling act in the back of your head, really. I mean, a lot of people like myself, we keep a list of to-dos, but not just keeping it to human, I’ve got so many things going on. You gotta have a better process to manage all the deliverables and the ins and outs. So for us, when we first started, because, well, I should say first started when, after I took over and transitioned the firm into being a WBE, women business enterprise, woman-owned as the majority owner, we would get so many different inbounds on so many different types of projects, whether it’s a sports facility, to higher ed, to K through 12, to commercial office. I mean, and all those deliverables and what’s required and what’s not required, very different. So to manage through that and to make sure that we hit every single deadline as it needs to, and we are keeping track of what’s required for each one, we immediately went to an in-house Excel-based, I know it was VBA, -based Excel file to really manage all of, all of our deliverables. It also was for transmittals, so RFIs or submittals, right? Shop drawings, things like that. Just keeping track of everything that’s leaving the office and when.
Suzie Engel [00:08:21]:
Building that same language, doing that so we’re all speaking the same way. And then from there, it’s really grown into multiple pieces of software, multiple apps. It’s just become really kind of our our backbone. And it’s not, you know, unique. There’s other firms that are doing it as well, but we’re doing it our way, which is how you create the buy-in. You have to do it our way. And it’s not necessarily my way, it’s the team’s way. It’s getting the whole team to play together.
Suzie Engel [00:08:48]:
You’ve got a few leaders within it that really champion it, sort of like your champions, but you gotta figure out how to get the team to do it the same way together and speak the same language together, understand what the service requirements are together. So that’s kind of the backbone of the system, the Impress process.
Katie Cash [00:09:07]:
So you and I, I think might be creatures of the same heart. So as you were telling your story of we just had to get a handle of what’s going in and out of the organization, I had a flashback to my first job in the industry. I was very lucky. I was still in college, but I was the second assistant to the state property officer in Georgia. Very big deal. I was very excited. And, you know, she oversaw all of the publicly funded construction, design and construction for the state, all the different, you know, state agencies, school systems, all of that kind of ran through her office. And I was charged with finding a way, Suzie, to figure out where the approval stood for change orders.
Katie Cash [00:09:51]:
I mean, she had stacks and stacks and stacks and stacks of these folders. Of change orders from, you know, I feel like every contractor in the state of Georgia at that moment waiting for her to approve something. And I did what you did. The only thing I knew to do, I’m like, I’m gonna use a tool I know. I’m gonna go to Excel. I’m gonna log the change order number. I’m gonna log the project when it came in. And then when it gets signed, I’m gonna put it in there.
Katie Cash [00:10:14]:
And then when they call and ask me if it’s been approved, I can pull up my spreadsheet and I’m not fumbling through trying to find stuff in her office. Right. And so it was just Finding little systems for quick wins where you had data to point to, and I could kind of get my wits together. And then from there, we learned a lot, and then it grows, and then you get buy-in, and then more people are involved, and smarter people get involved, and then you get an app, and then you get real-time things, and it really starts to multiply. We never had a fancy name like Impress, but I would love for you to maybe talk how you went from spreadsheet to the IMPRESS mindset and kind of how that’s shaping the, I guess I’ll call it Motz 2.0, kind of where you’re going. Right.
Suzie Engel [00:10:59]:
Well, I think you’re, you’re, all my salesmen, saleswomen that are listening are gonna appreciate this. I mean, ultimately at the end of the day, I do sales and that piece right there of what’s happening in the process, how is it affecting our product, but then getting the information back to sales. So critical. That is like such a critical step that I feel like most companies miss, making sure that, I mean, the good companies do it really well. So, I mean, not that everyone misses it, but making sure that sales, marketing understand not necessarily what mistakes got made, but what were the lessons learned and how did we now, what informed the process in a different way? Maybe it was something about a client, maybe it was something about a design team partner. There’s something that we were able to do better. But getting that all the way back to sales, I mean, that’s kind of the critical piece of why systems going to the next level. And that’s what made, forced us to go from the Excel spreadsheet into a SQL database so that all of our offices can now see it.
Suzie Engel [00:11:59]:
Because we, we’re across multiple offices. We’ve got Orlando, we’ve got Columbus, we just kind of started Cleveland because of an exciting project up there. And obviously here, headquarters in Cincinnati. So we have multiple places where everyone has to see the data, has to be able to access the data. It just kind of progressed into, okay, well, what other tools are available that we can see? And once we got out of Excel and moved on to like an actual database, you can build all sorts of apps from that. There’s just, it’s endless amounts of things that you can do. Dashboards. I mean, just crazy amounts of stuff.
Katie Cash [00:12:36]:
So, um, maybe one of the first pieces that I’ll call it like the feedback loop, first pieces of information that flew, like went through the process and came back to you and you’re like, ah, light bulb, I know how to sell this now. This is what we’ve learned. This is how we’re going to be different. This is going to give us a competitive edge. Maybe what was, what’s your lessons learned?
Suzie Engel [00:12:55]:
Well, certainly a big one is just general, generally speaking, how we were selling some of our services were not how they were being produced. They were either being— maybe I’ve had both scenarios where it took a lot more hours than what we initially projected, or a lot less hours. Because the lot less hours was really interesting, because either we were— we had developed an app, or we were using maybe some other pieces of software, or even AI, to help make our product better, or I guess easier to get done., and so it was kind of interesting. So giving, ’cause sometimes competitive edge, it’s either quality, sometimes competitive edge is price. It just depends. It depends on the application. And if I’m able to make, you know, the same or less by giving more of a competitive price, I mean, that’s kind of a great spot to be in and still have like a better, a better product. It just depends.
Suzie Engel [00:13:50]:
It’s, or if you have to be low because maybe the team wants to be competitive, you’re not scared. You’re not gonna lose, you’re not gonna lose your shirt. Because you’ve got a competitive edge with the process. But like, yeah, I mean, for example, um, this is kind of a nuanced one, but it was kind of interesting, is when we got started on a lot of this, and we’ll, we’ll get into kind of what makes a good process and your guidelines. Do you want it to be, you want it to be prescriptive enough that everybody knows what they’re doing and they understand that this is, you know, this is the sheet of music that we’re all going to sing off of. But you don’t want it to be so prescriptive that it limits your team from being creative. So you have to, order definitely does breed creativity, because if I know the rules, I know what I’m doing, I can then, I know where to push the boundaries and I understand how, you know, how to make something better or more efficient, what have you. But too much red tape, it’s like, maybe I want to try a different system here.
Suzie Engel [00:14:49]:
No, no, no, we have to stick with our standard operating procedure. There’s, there’s, there’s sometimes too much red tape is bad too. Well, we were kind of going down that red tape route with some of our ductwork design. And as it turns out, as everyone really knows, this is, I mean, sheet metal contractors, they bend metal according to whatever machines that they have. It’s not as if they all are gonna bend metal exactly the same way and every single piece or transition piece or whatever is gonna look exactly the same, and that’s how they get their competitive edge. So we had to, you know, kind of not care so much about getting the exact routing exactly right, exactly where it needs to be, but get it in a place that’s buildable, right? A place that’s not gonna cost 3x, pick the right materials, spec the right materials, spec the right insulation. But then let’s focus on the unit. Let’s focus on the constructability about, where that unit’s gonna go.
Suzie Engel [00:15:48]:
Are there some different efficiency things we can do with that unit? Do we really just wanna limit ourselves to one unit? Do we wanna do two or three, or what do we wanna do? As one of my engineers, Sarah, Sarah LaBelle, will tell you, is the system and process is in place so that the easy blocking and tackling we can do, get that done efficiently done, and then we can focus on the stuff that needs to be engineered and needs to be really thought about. So system selection, maybe some slick ways or, you know, cost-effective ways to do some of your electric and plumbing. But so we can focus on the place where the engineering has to happen, cuz that’s why you’re paying us. But if you wanted to do something more simple and cookie cutter, there’s plenty of firms and plenty of places that can do that. But if you wanna have some professional services, professional engineering done, efficient systems, that’s where you’re gonna go to more of a professional engineer.
Katie Cash [00:16:41]:
Like that’s why you do it. Hey listeners, if you work in AEC marketing or business development, you probably are juggling a lot right now between proposals, interviews, leadership expectations, onboarding new tools, maybe even new strategies, and you find yourself faced with not a lot of training that actually applies to our unique world of AEC. And that’s exactly why we built SmartSkills. I am excited to announce that Smartages is launching SmartSkills, a new affordable online AEC-specific training subscription program that’s designed to help AEC marketers and business development professionals think more strategically, and execute with more confidence. This program is not generic marketing theory. It’s practical, tactical training focused on AEC positioning, pursuit strategies, even client engagement, and ways that you can work more effectively across both marketing and business development. I hope you’ll check it out. Go over to smartagees.com/smartskills to learn more about the new subscription offering.
Katie Cash [00:17:46]:
Well, and I have to imagine that also has to instill some level of pride and confidence and kind of re-engagement in your team because they’re not sitting there doing mindless, like, dumb tasks and like, dadgummit, like, I have a professional license and this is what I’m doing?
Suzie Engel [00:18:02]:
Like, right, exactly. Yeah. I mean, so don’t get me wrong, I love that, that work design. It’s fun. It’s interesting. Some days it’s just nice. You wanna get into Revit and just let’s do some ductwork or let’s do some piping and that’s a good day. This podcast day, these are easy days.
Suzie Engel [00:18:18]:
Not every single day has to be, let’s come up with 3 options. Yeah. Yeah. For like a major, you know, major building that the governor’s gonna use. Like, it’s okay. Not every single day has to be that.
Katie Cash [00:18:31]:
It’s all right. It doesn’t have to be on an 11 every day.
Suzie Engel [00:18:33]:
Yeah.
Katie Cash [00:18:34]:
And I, I joke and I talk about him all the time on this show, but I, I am married to an engineer and I feel like I know this type of person and they love to be the hero. Like, they are intrigued by challenges and by trying to find a solution. Like, they accept— they will not accept no as an answer. Like, my husband will not accept no. He’s going to find a way, and he’s going to get super jazzed up when he’s figured it out. And you’re going to hear about it, Suzie. Like, you are going to hear about it, and his mom’s going to hear about it, and like our neighbor and everybody else is going to hear about it because he’s going to solve the dang thing. He’s so excited about it, and then he’s going to tell his team, and now that team knows, okay, well, this is a way to think.
Katie Cash [00:19:15]:
And then you kind of get this iterative, like, creative, always learning mentality that kind of starts to breed more and more excellence. So I want to go back to something you said a little bit earlier. You were mentioning that, you know, you’re really trying to produce a better product, but it’s not like you’re bending metal, right? Your product is The quality of your drawings and the quality of your communication, quality of your thought process. You’ve also shared with me that basically the Motz brand is process. Like that’s what separates you from other, you know, MEP firms, other commissioning firms that, that your project partners or clients could go to, but they come to you because you have this process. And whether it’s your process breeds efficiency so they can get tighter with their pencil when they put in their fee, or if it’s just solutions-based. So maybe talk a little bit about living and breathing it as a brand, like this process being synonymous with the brand. Okay, so Suzie, I want to go back to something you said earlier, and you mentioned that at the end of the day, you’re really trying to produce a better product.
Katie Cash [00:20:22]:
But with professional services, your product is the quality of your drawings. You’re not, you’re not producing sheet metal, right? Like you mentioned, those HVAC companies that are doing that, you’re producing drawings. Your product is also the quality of communication and your response time and being clear in that communication. It’s the quality of your thought process that went into the drawings. At the same time, you’ve also shared with me multiple times, you know, there’s plenty of project partners out there, whether they’re big E firms looking for a partner, an architectural firm looking for an MEP partner, or owners that are hiring you directly for that matter. They have what, bookooz to choose from. There’s lots and lots of engineering firms out there, but when they come to Moat, The big difference that your brand brings to the table is that your brand is synonymous with process. And I know that you’ve brought that forward with, you know, your brand promise of higher standards, better results.
Katie Cash [00:21:14]:
You’re living and breathing that on a daily basis by shepherding your team and your projects through the Impress process. But how do you really get the process, that brand promise, and everything kind of wrapped into the culture where everyone is bought in?
Suzie Engel [00:21:30]:
Yes. Okay. So, yeah, so, you know, there’s different people, different functionalities all throughout the office. We’ve got sales, we’ve got marketing, we’ve got engineers and commissioning agents. We’ve got everybody. But one of the things that we do, and again, kind of going back to that IMPRESS process, is we really do, like, at a high level, the same things every week, every month, every part of the year, different seasons of the year. Our leadership team, as well as department managers, we’ve really kind of created this lockstep frequency pattern, this whole thing every single week that we really repeat every single time. So the reason why I’m saying that is, again, going back to the, you don’t wanna be too rigid, but you also wanna have some rules and guidelines and some dependable, repeatable processes.
Suzie Engel [00:22:20]:
We really live it out. Mondays are always sales and marketing, all you know, between 9:00 AM and noon. We’ve got really quite a long meeting. We do the same thing, calls in process, proposals in process. We step through every single piece. Then on Friday, we’ve got the same financial meetings every single week, every single month. I myself, I lead our leadership team in a monthly and quarterly meeting to just review where the business is, where it’s headed, what things, initiatives that we’re working on. My marketing team, we have a cadence every other week that we’re, that we depend on every week.
Suzie Engel [00:22:55]:
All of our department, all of our departments, they have weekly meetings, monthly meetings. They just kind of have this like cadence of getting together. We do happy hours together to build that culture outside of just, outside of just work. We do volunteering outside of work. But it’s funny, we have like the Impress process to get everybody on it, to get everybody to sing the same, off the same sheet of music. We have really built a dedicated culture to really doing the same things at the same time. And that’s kind of a big deal. When I first started work, it wasn’t necessarily like a standard thing in the professional services industry really to do that.
Suzie Engel [00:23:33]:
I mean, that’s kind of corporate America to really have this set in stone. We are going to do financial planning at this time of the year, every single year. It’s not necessarily like what family-owned businesses really do. We do things when we feel like we’re going to do them. No, it’s really become ingrained in our culture. We do the same things. I know it sounds kind of, I feel like I am an engineer saying that. I mean, we do the same things every single week at the same time.
Suzie Engel [00:23:59]:
We’ve gotten to a standard habit of reviewing every single proposal with getting different leaders’ buy-in on it, making sure that we understand how many hours, what the scope is. We’ve gotten to a habit of doing that every single time. That trust and accountability that we’re all going to be there when we say we’re going to be there, and then doing things the same way. And also limiting. I say that and I’m like, oh wow, this firm must have a lot of meetings. We really limit the amount. We try, if it’s truly necessary, we’ll do it. If it’s part of our habits, we’ll do it.
Suzie Engel [00:24:31]:
But if we don’t need to meet, we’re not going to meet. That’s kind of a thing.
Katie Cash [00:24:33]:
Yeah. Nobody wants to. Nobody wants to, for sake of meeting.
Suzie Engel [00:24:36]:
Right. But that kind of culture, that kind of piece, that’s like kind of the living and breathing part of Impress, I have to say. Every single Monday morning, the production team, both commissioning and engineering, they sit down and look at the board. The board is a product that came out of Impress Process. It’s our deliverable database manager, DDM. And they go through, look through, I know they look through and they’re able to tell, but it’s that same thing, that same practice. We’re gonna do it every single Monday morning. And then obviously all the different departments, they pull it up separately, they look through it.
Suzie Engel [00:25:09]:
During their department meetings, whether that’s on Monday or Tuesday or Wednesday. You know, that’s our one piece.
Katie Cash [00:25:14]:
That’s—
Katie Cash [00:25:14]:
I think when you, when you have a process and it’s intended to be repeatable, and then your team knows that it’s going to be looked at on a regular cadence and there’s a high level of accountability to make sure that the data in there is correct, accurate, up to date, right? In marketing world, we often talk about repetition builds reputation, and that’s why we’re advocates for people really owning their brand promise and utilizing that like we see all the major consumer brands do. Right. And to be unapologetically everywhere that your customers are and to remind them of those core messages. And it sounds like you’re kind of bringing some of that thought process internally to how you operate. You have these repeatable cadences, you have these processes, you’re building muscle memory as you go through it. And as you continue to grow and scale your business and you add new offices, they’re all going to be part of this whole group kind of moving forward in the Moat’s way.
Suzie Engel [00:26:12]:
Yeah. It’s not a lot of you show up and you’re just kind of floating. It’s good. There’s structure in a positive way. It’s so, you know, it’s structured fun, right? Yeah. Upper and lower limits, you know, you gotta be able to understand the upper and lower limits so you can perform your job as best you can. So do the best product you can.
Katie Cash [00:26:31]:
So I love it. So I wanna talk maybe about something a little bit different. You mentioned you don’t love a meeting just for meeting’s sake. I know you also don’t just try innovate just to innovate, and you don’t just use AI because someone else is using AI, but you’re really intentional with how you iterate your processes and how you kind of grow and you add the apps and you add other things. So as we kind of wrap up today’s discussion, I want to talk maybe about what you’re projecting as the ripple effects going into the future and maybe what change might be on the horizon. We know a lot of changemakers, you know, they build something better. They pull the industry forward with them. You know, we’ve talked about you were a WBE firm, you’re still a WBE firm.
Katie Cash [00:27:18]:
You get lots of at-bats, but people come back to you because the quality is there, the service is there, the soft skills is there. So let’s talk maybe through a few questions. If you could change one default assumption whether it’s for MEP or commissioning, what would that be? You have your chance to right the industry on this, right?
Suzie Engel [00:27:42]:
Assumption. I know there’s so many different things I could say. You know, I feel like MEPs have this reputation of, we’re gonna put either the absolute most expensive thing, most expensive system that we could possibly imagine. It’s gonna be very difficult to control. Or we’re gonna put in something like beyond energy efficient and again, very difficult to control. Or we’re gonna do the absolute cheapest thing that we’re gonna have to replace in, you know, 10 years or whenever. It’s just, I know it’s hard to, I wish what I could change, and I know some of my ASHRAE friends are probably gonna be mad at me, but forever and always chilled water, hot water, VAVs. That is my system forever.
Suzie Engel [00:28:26]:
That’s a blank edge. It’s not, it is my love language. It’s 50-year system in some cases. It’s simple to operate in some case, in most cases, the facilities teams that we’ve worked with, it’s easy to maintain. It’s motors, it’s pumps, it’s stuff that we all can readily replace and fix and use. I wish what I could change about the MEP industry is that the beyond energy efficient solution in some parts of the country doesn’t quite pencil just yet. And your tried and true hot water, chilled water, man, it really, you can really get the efficiency where you need it. Obviously first costs are a big deal, but you can get that thing where you operate it really efficiently, especially if you get commissioning involved.
Suzie Engel [00:29:10]:
You can really get it humming where you can get 50 years out of a chiller, no problem. We do it all the time in the sense of like, We are currently, there’s some buildings where we’re currently replacing chillers that, cuz Motz Engineering’s 90 years old, Motz put it in. Okay. And now we are replacing it. So it’s just crazy that I wish I, I guess, I guess a default assumption is I’m not gonna go with heat pumps every single time. I kind of think that people get that impression. That’s what I’m gonna do. And we need to find the system that works best for you.
Suzie Engel [00:29:41]:
Okay. I want it to always be hot water, chilled water, but I know it’s ’cause that if I’ve had the mo— we’ve had the most success, it’s really easy to maintain. And that’s a little antiquated, you know, like your ’80s and ’90s engineer, that’s their system. So 2025, people want all sorts of fun stuff, VRF, geothermal, the whole nine yards. But I know it’s, I, that would be one thing which my ASHRAE buddies are gonna be upset with me for sure. Commissioning, commissioning, it’s not just a checked box. Okay? That is like my biggest thing on commissioning. I think a lot of people have this impression that commissioning agents are gonna come in and just pencil whip through an equipment test or what have you, and that’s just not the case.
Suzie Engel [00:30:28]:
While commissioning agents, they’re not controls engineers and they’re not gonna write all the programming for controls, they’re going to work with the engineer and the owner and whatever contractor to get the system working correctly. But just working correctly isn’t the final piece. Commissioning agents, if they’re doing their job, they’re going to get that system performing as efficiently as possible. And so they’re not just a pencil whipper. And you can expect, you need to expect out of their commissioning agent, out of your commissioning agent, that that’s what they’re going to do. That’s what they want to do. So many times, either whether it’s a civic job and it’s just kind of a general requirement that either the state has or what have you, it can end up being just a pencil whip. And that’s just, that’s just not what it is.
Suzie Engel [00:31:11]:
It’s a very serious thing. A very serious service. And I mean, there’s, there’s totally, there’s all sorts of research out about like companies or systems that are commissioned versus not commissioned. I mean, you can save 2x easily if you have a really nice commissioned system that’s working efficiently. It does take time though. I think that’s another impression that commissioning agents are like, well, something’s not working. I need someone to come in right now. And it’s Yes, we can come in and be the heroes.
Suzie Engel [00:31:42]:
Yeah. But sometimes it takes a little bit to get the system working just right, especially get through a couple seasons. You know, your hot water, chilled water system’s not gonna work the same in the summer versus the winter. Right. You have to be able to take some time, but they’re not a, it’s not a pencil-whipping operation. It’s a very serious, very engineering-heavy thing. I know they’re not stamping something necessarily, but They’re making the system work.
Katie Cash [00:32:07]:
They’re making it work. They’re really thoughtful. Yeah. They are there so that you don’t get calls of discomfort on the owner.
Suzie Engel [00:32:15]:
True. I mean, everybody, yeah. Proper engineer, they’re also, and even a proper contractor. I mean, they all three are, they are all part of that.
Katie Cash [00:32:22]:
It’s a team sport. Yeah, team sport. Part of. So Suzie, you know, your Moat is a brand promise, higher standards, better results. What do you feel maybe as an AEC industry as a whole, Is one higher standard that you wish we would just adopt immediately universally?
Suzie Engel [00:32:40]:
So, I kind of, I thought about this. I was thinking about this actually, because I don’t, I mean, there’s so many things I could say. There’s so many places, so many different items that I feel like we really as a group could get better at. I mean, I wish overnight everyone could adopt some form of electronic deliverable management, get away from whiteboards. I love whiteboards, don’t get me wrong. Lots of systems go up all the time, but if we could, not everybody’s able to do that overnight. So what is everybody able to do overnight? And I think it’s really clearly defining the deliverables. What does done look like at SD, DD, and CD? And whoever’s leading the project, whether it’s an architect or an engineer or whoever, being really thoughtful and intentional about delivering that description to all of your sub consultants so that everyone can work better as a team.
Suzie Engel [00:33:31]:
Being able to clearly communicate that with the owner or whoever is the ultimate user of the product, of the deliverable, but really clearly defining those steps.
Katie Cash [00:33:43]:
That could be really impactful.
Suzie Engel [00:33:45]:
It’s just simple. It’s very simple. That’s a simple thing. It could be a piece of paper, an email, it could be a phone call, but just clearly identifying this is how far we’re gonna take it and why. DDs in particular, design development milestone. So you’ve got schematic first and then design development, and then you go into contract documents or construction documents. But there’s always, it’s kind of a funny thing. It’s what are we using these documents for? You know, more or less you’re 50 to 60% through the design.
Suzie Engel [00:34:17]:
Are we using it for pricing? Are we using it just to show that we have something done? You know, that’s, that’s an honest thing that everybody, they wanna show progress to the client. But just if we’re able to define the goal of what we’re doing, it just makes it so much better for everybody. For the co-op that’s drafting to the project manager that has to deliver the product to the owner at the end of the day. Just clearly defining that is just really incredible. The la— the other one that I think would be really easy to do is share your lessons learned, your lesson learned internally with sales, with other parts of your company. But that is, that’s a huge one. Once we started really doing that internally and sharing lessons learned, just internally, you don’t need to like go tell a client or something like, I really messed this up and I just wanna, you know, clean. That’s not what I’m suggesting.
Suzie Engel [00:35:11]:
I’m suggesting if you messed something up or you learned how to do something better, oh, like, oh, I’m not gonna do it this way. Here’s something more efficient. And sharing it with the team, that is gonna change your culture immediately. And it’s going to, I mean, it’s just gonna promote such a higher standard and you’ll have a better result immediately. I guarantee it. So that is a big one that I don’t know why, I don’t know why that not everybody does it. In the power industry, people do it all the time. If something happened at a power plant or there’s a better way to do something, safety meetings, what have you, Everybody knows, I mean, that’s the culture, safety.
Suzie Engel [00:35:48]:
We have to be able to do something without someone getting hurt.
Katie Cash [00:35:52]:
So, I don’t know if we think we’re too special or we’re too busy, or, you know, this was this one client, this one site, this one project team. We won’t have this trifecta again. But I think that that’s really helpful of just taking a moment, call out, you know, the scenario, call out what you learned, call out how to use what you learned. I think moving forward is the biggest connective part.
Suzie Engel [00:36:15]:
Right?
Katie Cash [00:36:16]:
It’s just, hey, you know, we missed the mark here.
Suzie Engel [00:36:19]:
Right. Cool. And it’s funny, it’s for us in particular, it took, I know, I mean, it took us having the process to be able to have the tool to talk through if there was an overage on a job or, hey, we, you know, we did really well on this job. Like what, what did we do right? Like, or what did we change that was different that made us have so much success on this job? Being able to, because we’re moving so fast, I think that’s really what it is. You, you don’t even have time to take a breath. To think what went right or what went wrong. And it forced— we have the product and we have the, the software to look, and that’s what forced us to, to basically be able to do— we call ’em 360 reviews.
Katie Cash [00:36:58]:
I like that.
Suzie Engel [00:36:58]:
But we were able to look at ’em and do a review, what went right, what went wrong on the project. And it’s just hugely important, that self-awareness, that self-reflective. It’s a great practice too, just like in general. Life, it’s always good to take a step back and think, what went right? What went wrong? Well, what will I not do this again? I just did that yesterday in one of my son’s rooms. I was, how do I make this more efficient? How do I make changing out his GJ stuff easier, faster? What do I continue to trip up on? So you just don’t, you don’t have to do it just with work. You can do it in all sorts of ways.
Katie Cash [00:37:34]:
My, um, sister-in-law is in her final month of pregnancy and she’s asking all the right questions. And I was like, if I had to do it over again, Less steps, you know, less this, less, you know, less stuff. Simplify it. Don’t make more work for yourself. So yeah, it’s great advice. Take a step back in the business. Take a step back on the project. Take a step back in life with relationships.
Katie Cash [00:37:55]:
There’s always things we can take a beat. So Suzie, thank you so much for being so real, showing up as you. I always appreciate it. Really, really admire what you’re building, what you’re investing in at Motz and your team and really appreciating how you are raising standards and you’re doing it without burning people out, which is great too. So if you’re listening to the show and you’re in AAC leadership, I hope Suzie gave you some nuggets of practical advice, things that you could start using today that might change your organization overnight, maybe some bigger ideas that you could float throughout your strategic planning during this first quarter of the year and maybe work towards those in the future. And for our great listeners, thank you so much for listening all the way to the end. If this was your first time, I want to welcome you to the show. You don’t have to write a proposal to show up here and listen, but if you’ve been here maybe 2, 3, 4, 10 times, I would love for you to make it official.
Katie Cash [00:38:55]:
And so I will ask that you hit the follow button on your favorite podcasting platform, leave us a review, maybe even send this episode to another contact that is looking forward to making 2026 the year of change. We will be back soon with more stories from leadership across AEC.
Katie Cash [00:39:15]:
Suzie, thanks again. AEC Marketing for Principals is presented by Smartegies, the AEC growth consulting firm that has been developing smart business strategies for design and construction firms since 2008. The show is hosted by me, Katie Cash, Senior VP at Smartages. I would love to hear from you. If you have a question, a guest request, or a topic request for a future episode, send an email or a voice memo to [email protected]. And if you’re looking for past episodes, be sure to visit our podcast page at smartages.com/podcast. We hope you’ll tell your friends and colleagues about our show. And be sure to subscribe so you don’t miss out on future episodes.
Katie Cash [00:39:59]:
Thanks for listening.