Katie [00:00:02]:
Welcome to the AEC Marketing for Principles podcast. This show is designed as a conversation between sales and marketing principles to address trends, challenges, and best practices that are driving growth for professional service firms. Through our collection of discussions with subject matter experts, industry legends, and leaders, we aim to share thoughts and practical tips with our listeners that you can use for growing your AEC brands. Hosted by me, Katie Cash, senior vice president at SmartEgies, the AEC growth consulting firm that’s been developing smart business strategies for design and construction firms since 02/8. Hi, everyone. Welcome back to AEC Marketing for Principles. This is where we explore strategies and insights that drive the architecture, engineering, and construction industries. You all know me.
Katie [00:00:54]:
I’m Katie Cash, your host. And today, we are kicking off our SmartWin twenty five speaker spotlight series, and I have a fantastic guest. So for any of you new listeners that are sitting there wondering what in the world is SmartWin, that is SmartRG’s annual event. It takes place every Feb. 0, and we bring together the principals and senior marketing leadership from around the design and construction space to share stories, tips, and tricks. And today, I have Erica Fisher with me who is the director of marketing and business development at the Architects Studio out in Bryan, Texas. And Erica brings a wealth of experience to the table into today’s conversation. She is unique, y’all.
Katie [00:01:39]:
She spent, you know, over a decade on the owner’s side with a very large buyer of design and construction services. You all may have heard of this organization. It’s the Texas A and M University. So she spent a good amount of time there on the owner side before she transitioned into her current role at the architect studio. And Erica is gonna be joining a panel at Smartwin twenty five this year, and it’s all focused on the topic of small investments, big returns. And we hope to have Erica and her panelists share how making strategic, modest investments and making strategic decisions can actually deliver tangible ROI for design and construction firms. So, Erica, I appreciate you carving out time from your busy day to talk with us on the show today, and let’s get things started. I’d love for you to maybe share a little bit about the architect studio, what you all do, and talk to us a little bit about your role there.
Erica Fisher [00:02:40]:
Thank you, Katie. Thank you for having me. I’m so excited to be here. I’m excited for the opportunity to be at, Smartwin, and, really just excited to explore what it means to grow a small firm with marketing and that investment. So the Architect Studios in Bryan, Texas. We are a, I’d say, small to medium firm. We have about 12 to 15 people give and take with interns coming and going. We have, a lot of a and m interns that join us during their semesters.
Erica Fisher [00:03:09]:
We focus on higher education, municipal, faith based, and some private commercial work, new renovation, a lot of preservation work. And so that’s our main focus. And Downtown Bryan has a lot of historic buildings, and we’ve been blessed to be able to have our hand in a lot of them.
Katie [00:03:26]:
And you guys do some really interesting work. I remember when we first started partnering together and I was looking at your portfolio, it ranges from general facilities to various specialized things, to animal types of enclosures for science and technology and research. I was just kind of very robust. And the 1 thing that I picked up on is you are the go to local Bryan County Central Brazos Valley go to architect for all the things in that area. And you pursue work individually, and you’re also on a lot of partner teams. And I really enjoyed kinda getting to know the history of the firm and how y’all came about and how you look at opportunities moving forward. And it was a really nice partnership, and it’s been a really fun journey watching you all evolve and move to to where you are today. Before we go there, I do wanna talk a little bit about your previous role when you were at Texas a and m.
Katie [00:04:27]:
Because you and I share a little bit of that background coming from the owner side, being in a position where we got to experience kind of some of the best and some of the quirks, I think, of the design and construction services industry as they are pursuing work. And I certainly made my list of things that I really appreciated being on the owner side, things that people would do from a sales and marketing perspective. And I also had a list of, ugh, I really wish they would’ve do that kind of thing. So would love to hear your perspective on things that influenced you when you were on the owner’s side that you’ve now brought to help you make educated decisions on how you strategically pursue client accounts, project opportunities, and maybe how you even seek out some of those touch points with prospects in your business development outreach and and marketing outreach.
Erica Fisher [00:05:17]:
Absolutely. So I spent a long time working at Texas A and M, the system that oversees all the the campuses in the state and at the main campus university in College Station. Oversaw a lot of different unique projects. And I would say from an owner side, some of the things that I really enjoyed was, consistent points of contact, thinking of 1 architect in particular who sent the same team of 3 to every project at that campus, and I got to know them and develop a relationship with them. I know that’s not always feasible, but that really sticks out in my mind is that that team knew the campus. We We knew each other. We worked well together, and they showed up on-site, not just a phone call. Even though they were driving several hours to get there and they made that a priority, and that really stuck out to me as a benefit to the owner to have that consistent team and that consistent communication.
Erica Fisher [00:06:07]:
Always like to see, well put together proposals and RFQs with the right project name at the bottom. You know, if we got 1 that had the, wrong project name at the bottom because they rinsed and repeated and forgot to change it, that usually, went to the bottom of my list pretty
Katie [00:06:23]:
quick. It’s so funny. I hear that from so many owners, and I think, you know, as marketers, we just get caught up in the deadlines. And sometimes we don’t take time to do a fresh eyes audit, and we we become blind to it. And so I love that, you know, you picked up on that as a owner. And now when you’re putting those proposals together, you’re like, hey. Let’s check and double check that we’ve got the right owner there.
Erica Fisher [00:06:46]:
Yeah. Absolutely. Definitely the right owner and definitely the right project because, you know, the a and m system puts out a lot of a lot of projects and a lot of them are similar, and so you can get caught up in just, oh, I’ll just turn this in real quick. And that’s 1 thing I’ve learned is that there is no let’s just turn this in real quick. Each project pursuit, even if it’s for the same owner, is very unique. And positioning yourself and making sure that you have the right project list and the right resumes that go with it and the right story to tell, why you should be picked really helps. It’s not just let’s do a bunch of them and throw them at the wall and see which 1 sticks. It’s being very, very strategic.
Erica Fisher [00:07:22]:
For everyone that we turn in, we probably say no to 1 or 2 others.
Katie [00:07:26]:
Part of that, I think, is having the discipline to know when to say no. And I think a lot of people, certainly a lot of firms that we coach with, they feel obligated to pursue everything with client organizations where they wanna do business even if they’re not the right fit or maybe they don’t have the capacity at the time because they don’t wanna be perceived as not interested. And, you know, I know a lot of firms will put their name in the hat for a project they really don’t want because they wanna have a touch point with that owner for the next project that they’re really gearing up for. And we have a lot of conversations back and forth on whether or not that’s a good thing or a bad thing. And, Erica, I would love your perspective there. You know, when you were an owner and you were reviewing proposals by firms that clearly didn’t have the experience or ones that you thought, you know, you’re a 500 pound gorilla. Do I really need you on this particular project? I think you’d be better suited there. How do you how does that hit you, and and what advice would you give those firms that are trying to determine which projects they go and which ones they no go?
Erica Fisher [00:08:33]:
It’s tough. It’s it’s certainly not an easy thing that that go no go process is, tricky. But as sitting on the owner side, I I gave props to the small firms that went after things that were just above their typical because I knew they were growing and wanting that opportunity and they were trying. So even if they weren’t the best fit and didn’t get it, I always appreciated that they were trying and trying to better themselves. And if we got a firm that was clearly they were too big or this was clearly a project that, you know, maybe that wasn’t the best suited for them, I just kinda went, okay. Their their heart’s probably not in it. I know as an owner, skipping forward a little bit, when I interviewed, I wanted to talk to the boots on the ground people. I made it a rule that the project superintendent and the project manager that where I was gonna talk to every single day and date for eighteen months of the project.
Erica Fisher [00:09:28]:
Wanted to be able to to enjoy sitting down and eating lunch with them. And so if I felt like it was just somebody kinda, oh, well, this is just another 1. We’ll get it. I don’t really care. That spoke volumes as opposed to someone who I really knew was in it. It was the right fit, and then getting those people to the table and talking to them and making sure that, hey. I can have lunch with you every day for the next eighteen months, and we’re gonna get along.
Katie [00:09:51]:
I I don’t think you’re the only owner that has started to pick up on some firms that would send, you know, their a team that was so good at communication and presentation to kinda seal the deal. And then when they got into the actual project kickoff, it was like the superintendent and the project manager, pre construction manager, that they were in this, you know, twelve, eighteen, you know, sometimes longer period partnership with over the duration of the course of the project. And they’re like, if I would’ve known it was you, I don’t know that I would’ve done that. So I’ve seen more and more owners kind of insist on presentation participants be the boots on the ground team. And I’ve even seen some go as far as to say, executives are not welcome, you know, like, those types of things. So I think that’s really helpful insight to provide to our listeners is to really think strategically about who’s actually gonna be on the project. You don’t ever wanna bait and switch. No owner likes that.
Katie [00:10:50]:
But making sure that those individuals are prepared and have time to review, you know, drawings if they’re on the construction side or if they’re on the design team, have a chance to really understand the the program that the project is gonna be so they can speak intelligently to it because these are really passionate professionals that really do enjoy their craft. I don’t think an architect would be an architect today if they didn’t love it or an engineer or a contractor. Right? There’s so many opportunities out there, and our industry is full of so many bright and talented individuals. And I sit back. I I coach a lot of teams as they gear up for interviews, Erica, as you well know. And I’ve never met a superintendent that didn’t tell me, you know, I didn’t sign up for this when I got into construction. I’m I’m a job trailer kinda guy. I’m a boots on the ground.
Katie [00:11:38]:
I’m a muddy boots kinda guy. And I’m like, I get that. And I’m not asking you to be anything you’re not. I just want you to talk about how you’re gonna manage your job site and, you know, how you’re gonna make sure everybody that steps onto that job site is gonna go home safely at night. Don’t think of it as a big formal presentation interview. Just think of it as a conversation because that’s what you’re trying to convey is, hey, mister and missus owner. I understand your project. I understand your business.
Katie [00:12:04]:
I understand I am a guest on your campus. And you wanna work with me, and you wanna trust me, and you wanna know that I’ve got your back. And, yeah, if you’re gonna see my ugly mug every day, you want there to be a smile on the other side. Right? Absolutely. You know, this is still a people business at the end of the day. And so I think that the people matter.
Erica Fisher [00:12:24]:
It is. And I always had superintendents, so I don’t this isn’t me. I’m not the 1 to be interviewing. And I said, no. Exactly. You are. My mentor was a superintendent, and I wouldn’t be here today without him. You know, 1 of my favorite questions is, what’s been your favorite project ever in your career and why? And that got them excited and talking, and I got to see who they really were, and that helped a lot.
Katie [00:12:44]:
Yeah. You can’t ask a single architect, engineer, contractor, program manager, commissioning agent, you know, no matter who they are, what their favorite project was, where there’s not a story. Right? Everybody lights up to that, and I love getting those perspectives too because it’s not always what you expect. You know? Sometimes it’s like it was the most challenging project or it was, you know, the biggest or the most public facing 1 or whatever it might be. Might been a been their first project where they really got their feet wet in the industry, and and I love hearing those stories too. Erica, I wanna pivot real quickly. I wanna talk a little bit about your panel that’s at Smartwin this year. So your panel, you have some other individuals that are gonna join you, but it’s all about making small strategic investments that generate returns.
Katie [00:13:34]:
And I know you and your team at the architect studio, y’all have made some strategic investments over the last few years that’s that’s really attributing to some some nice growth for the firm. I mean, you shared with me recently how you’re getting more opportunities with different clientele. You are being considered for larger projects as a standalone, right, as just architect studio without having to partner with others. And you shared with me just how exciting you were to close out 2024 with such a nice hit rate this year in terms of being able to close new business. I’d love for you to share with our listeners maybe an example of 1 of those investments that you and your team have made, whether it’s in marketing or how you approach strategic business development or, you know, new applications or whatever that might be, that you feel like has really paid off and attributed to some of those growth metrics?
Erica Fisher [00:14:29]:
It’s hard to pinpoint 1 thing. Before I came on board in did not have a dedicated marketing and business development position. So I kinda got to come in on the ground level and write the program and kinda forge my own way. I will say, and I’m not just because I’m here, but SmartEgies has been 1 of the best investments we’ve made because I’m a team of 1, and it allows us to do a lot that we would not have normally been able to do. You know, I’m doing RFQ, social media, business development, networking, events, vendor booths, all sorts
Katie [00:15:03]:
of things. Anniversary campaigns. Like, don’t forget. You’ve got a lot going on.
Erica Fisher [00:15:07]:
Yeah. It it’s tough being a team of 1, but y’all definitely make it possible to do way more than well, than I could accomplish by myself. I think that small investment has, 1, been in in the right person. We call it the right person, the right seat. I was very excited to have the opportunity to better architect studio and use my network. So 1, investing in having someone dedicated in that role, and then some of the small investments we’ve made is in training. I learned InDesign, which is something they were not using, but is the industry standard for RFQs. And then setting aside a marketing budget for some social media for some conferences.
Erica Fisher [00:15:44]:
I know this is Texas based, but the Texas College and University Facilities Conference is a highly coveted spot, and we we spent more than we would have normally. And we’re a small firm. We spent $5,000 to go there. That was a lot for us. And it was a huge investment and a huge return. Smarter Juice was able to help us with the geofencing and the ad campaign, and that was a huge step for us. And our higher ed market is just growing and growing and growing and got on the cover of the Texas Architect magazine this past year with 1 of our projects. So I think just investing in the right networking opportunities, training your people, and then finding those those sponsorships or those events that you can support that get your brand out there within your budget, every little step counts.
Erica Fisher [00:16:33]:
You know, we’re just taking baby steps and the baby steps keep adding up little by little by little. Couple thousand dollars here and a couple thousand dollars there is what we can afford, but we’re doing it. We’re picking the right things, and it’s it’s paying off.
Katie [00:16:48]:
Having been a, a fly on the wall through this partnership. I think 1 of the, the things that y’all have done so well is kind of shifting the mindset from being a very reactionary group that wants to support, you know, anything and everything your client base is doing to being more strategic and really looking out for your organization and thinking about, okay, who is our ideal customer profile? Where do they tend to hang out in groups? And where can we make strategic investments of time as well as, you know, financial investments that give us the greatest opportunity to advance, you know, our brand reputation, help us fortify relationships that will hopefully convert to, you know, revenue down hall. Because I think before, your firm was driven by a lot of seller doers, and let’s be honest, lots of our listeners can can resonate with this. We’re more doer sellers than seller doers because the work is always gonna come first, and we don’t tend to do the selling until we really need to. And sometimes that’s too late. But, you know, I think before you, Erica, that the principals did a really good job as best as they could to try to be there when the clients wanted them to, but they weren’t thinking proactively about how to leverage, say, events to make a bigger impact that would help set up their date calendar after the event so that they weren’t constantly, you know, trying to go through the Rolodex and figure out who they needed to meet with. Right? And I think that making some of those strategic investments in online activities, such as the geofencing campaign, allowed you to almost have, like, another person, if you will, promoting the brand, just kind of in a different avenue. And I I think you guys have made some really smart investments where we can point back to, this was the investment we made.
Katie [00:18:36]:
This is what we got out of it. This is how it’s moving the the organization forward. And I really commend y’all for really adopting new philosophies, new tactics at almost breakneck speed compared to other members in our industry, and I think that’s been really fun to watch. And, you know, I think you all look at your budget if as if it’s your own personal finances, and you think really hard about, okay. Well, if I have this, you know, this little budget and I do this, then that means I can’t do that over there. Is that what we really wanna do? And you’ve been really disciplined at thinking longer term, and I think it’s gonna pay off. Yeah. Before we wrap up today, I’d love for you to maybe give some advice to our listeners because I know a lot of our listeners have firms that are similar to yours, where, you know, it’s the 1 man band marketing and sales show.
Katie [00:19:26]:
So they’ve got 1 Erica. There are smaller organizations, so there’s limited budget. What advice would you give them in terms of how do they prioritize their sales and marketing investments, whether that investment is in time or in budget spending?
Erica Fisher [00:19:42]:
That’s a great question. It’s not an easy 1. When I first started, I kinda sat back and took a look at, okay, what what is the priority? And for our particular firm, our brand wasn’t out there. So solidifying that brand, we redid the logo, the tagline, the website, getting those basics in place was definitely the first move. And so while your end goal might be going after those huge projects or being recognized with an award, you have to take the baby steps to get there. And so I think having those foundational pieces in place and prioritizing those, you know, I’ve really learned to do, urgent and important matrix and kinda walk through that and and prioritize my tasks that way. And so priority number 1 when I got there was redoing our RFQ templates to be easier to use and more appealing to the eye, redoing our website, our tagline, and making sure our branding was solid, and then starting to get a consistent social media presence so that people knew where to find us, who we were, what we stood for, and start to build that foundational block to build on to then start to go to more of the specialized events or things like that once people knew who we were and and recognized that we were in the community and and not going anywhere and that we’d actually been there for a long time. People just hadn’t seen us the way that they needed to.
Katie [00:21:04]:
Thank you so much for sharing that, Erica. This little mini interview has been great. I know that you are gonna share many more tidbits and stories with the group live and in person on Feb. 11 at Smartwin in Atlanta. I’m so excited to see you on the East Coast and have you join us for the day. So for anyone listening that hasn’t yet registered for Smartwin, there’s still a little bit of time. There’s a few seats left. So go ahead and go over to smartages.com.
Katie [00:21:35]:
You will see the button right there on the home page for Smartwin twenty five. You can secure your spot. I do wanna mention that as an in person only event, so you have to be there to get the tips and to do the networking, and I and I guarantee you the networking is pretty top notch. I I find that most of our participants that have come in the years past have shared just how much they’ve gained by being in the room and being there amongst peers and others in in this space. They’ve learned just as much at the table as they have from the speakers and the panelists. And, also, if you’ve enjoyed this episode, be on the lookout for other speaker spotlight mini episodes. We are gonna feature all the participants from Smart one twenty five as we gear up for this year’s event. And until then, thanks, everyone.
Katie [00:22:21]:
Y’all stay safe, and stay smart out there. AEC Marketing for Principles is presented by SmartEgies, the AEC growth consulting firm that has been developing smart business strategies for design and construction firms since 02/8. The show is hosted by me, Katie Cash, senior VP at Smartages. I would love to hear from you. If you have a question, a guest request, or a topic request for a future episode, send an email or a voice memo to [email protected]. And if you’re looking for past episodes, be sure to visit our podcast page at smartergies.com/podcast. We hope you’ll tell your friends and colleagues about our show and be sure to subscribe so you don’t miss out on future episodes. Thanks for listening.